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I wanna make some fake rocks... with your help!

I want to make some rock speakers for my yard and I'd like some advice on making the rocks. The speaker part is fairly straightforward for me but I've never worked with fiberglass or cement (much) before. Anyone interested in brainstorming at TS this week? If others are interested then we could make a class of it or at least bulk-order supplies.

The speakers I'd like to emulate are these: http://www.stereostone.com/

Let me know!
Jon

fake rocks

I propose vacuum forming the shape that we want, adding pins in the right location for the speaker holes, using epoxy resin (or maybe AB foam) to coat the inside of the mold, and finishing the outside of the mold with that stone-like spray paint (but use an epoxy coating first if it's AB foam). It's probably possible to calculate the displacement of the rock if we want to tune the speaker or add porting. Perhaps make them active speakers by building a small amp? Perhaps an ipod / ipad dock?

Count me in for the discussion and probably the build - I would love to have a pair of these as well. I'm available pretty much anytime starting Wednesday.

DO YOU WANNA ROCK!? (powerchord, powerchord, powerchord...))

Wouldn't it be easiest to harvest some boulders and then mill out the insides? Character-building, too.

I'm still thinking it would be cool to figure out what to cover in a fiber course. This project might be a good way to think that through.

I don't need any outdoor

I don't need any outdoor speakers, but I can help with or lead this build if you'd like. FG would be the easiest method and be more portable, cement would give the best sound but would be heavy. Rocks are fun to sculpt, difficult to make a rock "wrong".

Wrong rocks

"difficult to make a rock 'wrong'." Heh heh... you haven't hung around enough miniature golf courses in Myrtle Beach then. lol I've seen some really, really awful fake rock.

FWIW, I did a LOT of research a couple years ago for making fake rock for aquariums. Some VERY different requirements than for outdoor speakers, but I finally determined I was going to try it with a mold and a particular epoxy resin I found. Using a mold FROM real rock yields the most authentic rock look, unless of course you are particularly artistic.

The fake rock speakers I've seen (look exactly the StereoStone) were all made out of molded resin.

Molding resin would be the

Molding resin would be the product to use if you wanted to make multiples of the same shape/size, because it reproduces fine detail very accurately, is weatherproof and can be tinted so any chips would not be noticable. The downside is that it requires an accurate model real or sculpted, an expensive to make complex rubber mold of both the outside and inside (the resin is a liquid so it would make a solid rock if you just molded the outside surface), and the resin is expensive for a project this large. This all would make it more of a factory process than a one of a kind.
Realistic rock is not difficult to model if you are observant and really look at example natural rocks. I'd suggest starting to collect photos of rocks that you like for their shape, texture and/or colors (not necessarily all in one rock). If you can find some fist sized samples, collect them as well. Rock shops will have a number of different type rocks to look at/photograph.
Different rocks will have different characteristics: water worn rocks look totally different from field rock, igneous rock looks different from sedimentary rock. The most natural looking "fake" rocks are going to resemble the native rock found around them. "Feature" rocks are transplanted rock not native to the area used as a focal point in a landscape or arrangement or to create a "scene".
Try and focus on what type rock you find most attractive and then on what characteristics are in common throughout.

I understand the limitations of resin...

I agree it's expensive. Other than that, I'd have to disagree on the other points.

"The downside is that it requires an accurate model real or sculpted"-- it doesn't "require" an accurate model. If you give it a crappy model, you'll just reproduce a crappy model. :) The most accurate model is a real rock... can't get any easier than that. So why is this a downside? Because molding is more difficult or laborsome? From Jon's other projects here, I'm guessing the level of effort is probably not as much of a concern. ;)

"an expensive to make complex rubber mold of both the outside and inside"-- a 2-part mold is a pain and unnecessary. I would rotocast it, although you could also lay it up in layers, especially with a fast curing resin. I'd rotocast it.

I should have mentioned previously that most of the projects I reviewed actually used resin over a sculpted styrofoam "rock" (with varying results). This is how I would do this project, if I was interested in a relatively easy process. I would coat with mortar or cement render (with acrylic). Resin could of course be used, but it's much more expensive. They used it because it was for use in aquariums (water chemistry). Of course the other problem is removing the foam-- you can choose some form of environmentally less-friendly solution (solvent or burning it out) or manually remove it. This would be the least desirable aspect of this technique, in my opinion.

I would build a styrofoam

I would build a styrofoam beadboard "buck" for the inside and support. Cover it with a polyethylene bag (cleaner's bag would do) to make removal of the foam easier. Then lay up a combination of FG mat and cloth to a suitable thickness. I would then use a layer of Bondo over the FG and various tools to sculpt the details and texture. Don't like what it looks like? Grind off the Bondo and redo, or even saw off a portion of the FG and rebuild. Once it is to your liking, (easily) pull out the foam, give it a coat of primer and paint. Making a mold from a real rock would be time consuming and expensive for a one time use, especially if you wanted to rotocast it. Then there is the problem of where do you get a rotocast machine? The cost of your two rocks just went into multi $K each! Not trying to shoot down your ideas, but there's a big difference between imagining how to do something the "if I had unlimited funds" way (you could just go out and buy them, or hire me to make them! :) ) and what's practical and cost effective way to produce a real product. I think John would actually like to end up with an actual pair of rocks and probably would prefer they did not look identical to each other.

Biggest reason people say they can't draw or sculpt is they don't really observe. When they draw a house they don't look at what real houses looks like, they draw the sterotype they were taught pre-elementary school, a box with an inverted V on top then add a couple more boxes to represent a door and windows, put a chimney on the roof and finish it with a curlicue of "smoke" coming out of the chimney. The rocks at the miniature golf course for example, the people didn't try to look at real rocks and reproduce their characteristics, they built their (simplified) vision of rocks from their mind's eye. Take a look at the sculpted "rocks" at Disney World and you can't tell them from the real thing.

Making an artificial rock for therapy?

Hey Jon,

You can make a fake rock OR you can cut to the chase and just buy a couple. Creating a mold is expensive and if you're just looking for a couple of rocks it's probably more cost-effective (time, materials, trial and error and a mess) to just purchase a couple that you can carve into fairly easily and install your speakers. Almost all artificial rocks are created with a hollow center and the amount of labor you'll us to cut a hole and seal will be worth the cost to just purchase the rocks.

(warning: shameless self promotion coming)
My company, StoneScape Industries, has done the work for you. We've got lots of rocks to choose from that are all conducive to you cutting a hole and installing speakers. Stop by and take a look. To cut into our rocks all you would need is either a power saw or very sharp knife. For safety's sake it's probably best to use a power saw (jigsaw) so you can enjoy your speakers and not risk a trip to the hospital. We've thought about marketing speaker rocks over the years and still may do so but we find the many customers prefer just cutting into our rocks so they can customize on their own.

Just some thoughts. If you're just in the mood to make rocks for the therapy make sure you've got some great ventilation away from the family and really take some time to make sure you're safe with the chemicals you choose to make your rocks out of.

http://www.wemakerocks.com

Anthony

Not local, but they do ship

I almost deleted the post above as spam, but hey, he does admit to the shameless promotion and it was obviously written by a human who has read our forum and has one possible solution to the question at hand.

Be aware however, that he is in Huntington Beach, CA, so you probably won't "stop by to take a look", but you can see a lot of pictures on his website.

Scott

Scott Rocks! (pun intended ;o)

Hey Scott,

I appreciate it. The post above is sincerely not meant as spam... completely an elective suggestion. I just remember the days of 'making my own rocks' on a whim and I ended up with a lot of headaches and a wife that was REALLY mad at me. If Jon's not married or he has the facility to go away... go very far away from intentional flying dishes then he needs to make rocks. It can be a lot of fun as I found out.

My suggestion only comes from experience but, in turn, molds last a long time depending on your process and can yield more rocks than one. The hard part is developing the texture process - which takes a long time to develop. I remember my first rock came out looking like a clump of chiseled brown poop. But that's another story.

Thanks for letting me participate.
Anthony

Wow, thanks everybody! Lots

Wow, thanks everybody! Lots of food for thought here! The creation of the rocks is almost completely within the Maker philosophy. It's an opportunity to learn a new skill or two and probably a few new curse words!

TechShop Menlo Park has a

TechShop Menlo Park has a silicone mold making class: http://www.techshop.ws/classlist_seats.cfm?a=1&i=11999853

Maybe they'd be willing to share their class materials with us if we have an instructor who is willing to teach that here.

One of the reasons I

One of the reasons I downplayed the idea of making a rubber mold is that I have made rubber molds, and therefore I could teach that process as well. It's just that I know how much work and expense it is to do. IMHO unless you are making something small that you also want to produce in multiples it's far from cost effective.
Note the lab fee for the above class: 20.00 to make a mold for an object the size of a quarter.

My first thought was concrete

My first thought was concrete or hypertufa--maybe the most affordable option too. There's an instructable that shows one way to do it:
http://www.instructables.com/id/How-To-Make-Faux-Rocks/
and another link:
http://www.the-artistic-garden.com/faux-rock.html

I'd also recommend a book, Creative Concrete Ornaments for the Garden by Sherri Warner Hunter, that shows a good project. Basically you create a rebar armature and cover it with expanded metal mesh (chicken wire might work too) then cover that with concrete.

Another option it to build up a hollow form from styrofoam and apply concrete over that.

Good luck!

Jon, lots of different

Jon,
lots of different approaches here for you to choose from.
Now to decide which is the most feasable, within your budget, and interesting to you for your purpose.
If you would like to discuss the pros and cons of my suggestions and meeting your needs further I'll be in the wood shop/shopbot area all Tues afternoon and evening working on the kitchen cabinets.

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